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am not able to take it any further than that. I do intend to submit to the Court that Mr. Ismay cannot be treated as an ordinary passenger. I do not think that the view taken by him at one time - I doubt whether it is persisted in in consequence of some answers - that he was merely an ordinary passenger, could be substantiated. But, my Lord, it takes us no further in the case, and I do not think it assists your Lordship, so far as I know, in answering any of the questions that are put to you, because we still have to get to what happened; and if Mr. Ismay took no part in the directions as to navigation and offered no advice to the Captain, which is the evidence as we have it before us, I am not able to carry it any further than that. The Commissioner: Then, Sir Robert, I do not think you need trouble yourself to go in detail through Mr. Ismay’s evidence; you may strike that out. Sir Robert Finlay: If your Lordship pleases. Then another suggestion was made, I am not sure that it was made by the Attorney-General, but by some of the gentlemen who addressed your Lordship, that Mr. Ismay ought to have said to the Captain, “Go slow.” The Commissioner: Well, you may certainly strike that out. The Attorney-General: I certainly never made that suggestion. The Commissioner: That is an absurdity. Sir Robert Finlay: Sometimes it seems he was to blame for interfering, and at others to blame for not interfering. May I recall to your Lordship’s memory the evidence there is that Mr. Ismay repeatedly travelled by the boats. He travelled as an ordinary passenger. Of course, it was known to everyone that he occupied a very influential position in the Company, but that did not affect his relations with those in command of the vessel one whit. Your Lordship will recollect that one of the many Captains who have been called in this case said that Mr. Ismay had gone with him repeatedly, and that he never had in the slightest degree occupied, so far as the management of the ship was concerned, any position except that of an ordinary passenger. Of course, that he was Chairman of the Company is a fact that in a sense marked him out from other passengers. My friend the Attorney-General is quite right in saying that in that respect he was not an ordinary passenger, but it did not one whit affect his relations with the navigation of the vessel, and a man of Captain Smith’s standing was the last man in the world to have permitted anything of the sort; in fact, nothing could be further from Mr. Ismay’s habits, as proved in this case. I therefore, after what your Lordship has said, hope that I may dismiss all the attacks which have been made upon Mr. Ismay in this respect as unfounded, and having really no relation to the facts of the case. Your Lordship will recollect what I said about the idea that was put forward, not by the Attorney-General, that there was an intention to make a record passage. The Commissioner: You need not dwell upon that. I am satisfied that no record passage was being made. The Attorney-General: That was disproved. Sir Robert Finlay: Yes, and if it were worth going into, your Lordship would find that the White Star Company have never gone in for very great speed. Their speed compared with other vessels built at the same date is rather lower. I have a table here which shows that in detail. The Commissioner: I do not think you need trouble about it. Sir Robert Finlay: Very well, my Lord, that concludes what I have to say with reference to the first head of the case, and I trust I may be very much briefer in the second. I am extremely sorry to have been so long, but your Lordship realises the importance of having the evidence grouped under the different heads, and I have endeavoured to do that as shortly as I could. The Commissioner: Please do not regret it, for what you have said has been the greatest assistance to me, and I know quite well that if you have been long, I have probably been the cause of it. Sir Robert Finlay: The real cause of it is the bulkiness of this record. The Attorney-General: I think really it has assisted because if my friend had not read the
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